Nasty frequency [solved]

    Hi !


    Just received my new Kemper and completed my first session.
    All in all, i found it to be a fantastic unit, but there is still one issue that is annoying me.
    In all overdriven / distorted tones , I can hear a frequency that seems wrong to me :
    call it metallic, nasal, whatever, it's hard to describe for me, so I have created a
    sample with and without the frequency. You'll see what I mean by hearing the difference:


    https://soundcloud.com/lef38/test-eq



    The sample starts with the annoying frequency present, then without, then with again, then without.


    Disclaimer: this sample has been made with a pod, because I already knew how to record
    and EQ out a frequency with it, but it is demonstrating exactly the problem I have with the kemper.


    My question is simple : is it normal and how to get rid of it ?

    Posting a POD clip isn't helpful! Post a clip of the Kemper and maybe someone can determine whether this is an objective complaint or something subjective ;)


    One common solution to a lot of issues faced by people is setting the input settings for the Kemper the right way from the outset. That'll ensure there's no clipping of the signal, or underpowering the input either.

    Thx but the sample is just here to describe what i'm talking about, i.e. an annoying frequency.
    The problem is the same with my kemper.
    I might be able to do a sample with the kemper, but i'm not able (yet) to EQ it out, so i won't be able to outline the difference.


    As you said, maybe i just need to adjust my input settings. Is there any good tutorial about this ?

    The 'annoying frequency' you posted is very wide, very loud, and an integral part of distorted guitar sound.
    The Pod is notorious for being fizzy - which is what you've just presented.


    Tube amps do it as well. The louder they get and the less distorted the sound the less these harmonics are apparent, but they are always there.
    Different amps do it differently, too. I assume this is a Recto or a 5150 model on the Pod?
    'modern' amps with lots of high end cause lots of fizz when the gain is turned up too high.
    Some recordings contain LPFs, which cut all frequencies above a certain point, or a shelving EQ that cuts all frequencies above a certain point by a certain amount - which is what you did to 'fix' the 'problem'.
    More often, that fizz 'drowns' in the vocals, drums and double tracking so you don't hear it, but it helps the guitars 'cut through' the mix. I suspect your 'fixed' sound on the POD will drown completely in a band mix.


    It is doable with the profiler, easily. You can use the High freq and gain in the studio EQ (turn the gain to, say, -8dB and play with the frequency from 6Khz and upwards until you find the spot),
    or the Low pass effect - again, just play with the frequency until you get there.


    This has nothing to do with input settings.
    However, you could (and should, IMO) learn to play with much, much,
    much much much
    MUCH
    less gain. Even the heaviest of black-metal tracks i've heard aren't as compressed as the clip you posted. :P


    Good luck.

    "But dignity is difficult to maintain
    stamina requires constant upkeep
    repetition is boring
    and you pay for grace."

    Thanks for the insight, it was useful.

    Quote from Quitty

    I assume this is a Recto or a 5150 model on the Pod?

    well spotted ! It was the dual rectifier model.


    The only thing, is when I use this model with my DT25 (the line6 25w tube amp that works with the pod), I don't hear this frequency at all.
    The sound is sweet, perfect, but too loud for my neighbours 8o


    During lunch time i could try some input settings, and the distorted sense *seems* to be helpful here.
    I would appreciate any tutorial for input settings, as the manual doesn't tell much.


    The DT25 has a guitar speaker - which naturally attenuates high frequencies.
    If you tried running a song from your MP3 player through your DT25 speaker (even not through the amp itself) it will sound muffled and muted - guitar speakers don't produce many high frequencies.


    When recording, you're playing back through hi-fi speakers which do produce these frequencies.
    The system that should solve these discrepancies is the cab modeling. I don't know which Pod you're using, but the older Pods have terrible cab emulation.
    The HD uses IR, which is similar to what the profiler is using - different cabs might make it better.
    The profiler, therefore, should sound fairly close to whatever you're profiling. If you still need to use corrective EQ, you might need to profile the amp differently (mic it differently, or use different settings if you profiled the Pod).

    "But dignity is difficult to maintain
    stamina requires constant upkeep
    repetition is boring
    and you pay for grace."

    Don, i'll put a Kemper sample as soon as I can set it up.


    Quitty, I'm using the HD500 , and with the kemper i'm only using factory rigs at the moment.


    Thanks all for the feedback

    I'm confused? If I understand correctly you recorded a POD to demonstrate a problem that you find on the Kemper??? I believe that you are saying that you figured out what you needed to do with EQ to correct it and then turned on/applied that eq to two parts of the clip to show the difference. Do I understand correctly that you have the same problem with POD? If so doesn't that say something? Are you using the same guitar? Does a different guitar sound better? Perhaps you are realizing that you don't like your pickups or maybe you need to adjust them lower from the strings a little?


    Input - Set distortion sense to 0. Christoph has even suggested not using this setting. Clean sense is what you use to balance perceived volume between clean and distorted profiles overall. Start at 0 and you should notice a jump in volume when going from clean to distorted tones - especially with single coils. Keep checking it by switching between various clean and dirty rigs and going back into clean sense to increase it until you get it where your cleans are as loud/nearly as loud as you dirty tones (unless you want a bug jump). It may be in my head but I think that many of the clean/cleanish profiles come to life when you have increase the clean sense properly. I thought that many of the stock profiles last year were a little drab until I learned later in the year how to adjust clean sense. The value/number of the clean sense setting is really going to depend on how hot the pickup is and what height you have them set at, so you should store the setting and name it after each of your guitars and then when change guitars you just hit input and turn the browse knob to see all of your stored input settings as you named them. I can tell you that on my strat with low output pickups I'm somewhere around 7 or 8.

    "Tone is in the fingers" is not a necessary response to anything that I might type on any internet forum threads. Thank you.

    Second time the question is asked so let me quote myself :

    Quote from lef38

    the sample is just here to describe what i'm talking about, i.e. an annoying frequency.
    The problem is the same with my kemper.

    well i could have provided no sample at all, i was just hoping this would help to understand the problem.
    Sound is hard to describe with words, especially for a non english native speaker ;)


    It happens at least with my 2 bridge humbuckers:
    - bareknuckle riff raff (medium output)
    - seymour duncan custom 8 (high output)
    And it doesn't happen with my tube amp + cab setup, so no the pickups are not at fault.


    Thanks for the clean sense tutorial, that was helpful.

    Also i must add that i don't like the EQ i used; for me it's not the solution, it's cutting too much tone.
    But at least it fills its only purpose: pinpointing the annoying frequency.

    Edited once, last by lef38 ().

    Quote from BuckeyeBrown


    Input - Set distortion sense to 0. Christoph has even suggested not using this setting. Clean sense is what you use to balance perceived volume between clean and distorted profiles overall. Start at 0 and you should notice a jump in volume when going from clean to distorted tones - especially with single coils. Keep checking it by switching between various clean and dirty rigs and going back into clean sense to increase it until you get it where your cleans are as loud/nearly as loud as you dirty tones (unless you want a bug jump). It may be in my head but I think that many of the clean/cleanish profiles come to life when you have increase the clean sense properly. I thought that many of the stock profiles last year were a little drab until I learned later in the year how to adjust clean sense. The value/number of the clean sense setting is really going to depend on how hot the pickup is and what height you have them set at, so you should store the setting and name it after each of your guitars and then when change guitars you just hit input and turn the browse knob to see all of your stored input settings as you named them. I can tell you that on my strat with low output pickups I'm somewhere around 7 or 8.


    While it's not the main topic here, I would appreciate not to tell the myth about Clean Sense affecting the tone and feel over and over. It is not true - proven.
    What the manual tells is the full story. Nothing beyond that.

    Thank you everybody.
    It's great to see such commitment from the whole community and even the owners, something i was not used to with my previous unit ;)
    I'll take time to learn about all the settings and do my best to make it work as desired.
    If it worked for others, it should work for me !

    Yesterday I found the origin of the problem : the headphones !
    I had the idea to try with other headphones and the sound was instantly much better, not perfect, but much better.
    To make it perfect, I had to browse other cabinets until I found the right one.
    I also may say that the Space parameter in the Output settings helped a little.


    The *faulty* headphones were the Bose AE2 , although I had been satisfied with them until now, and they are known to be much more neutral than other Bose hp.
    They are simply a mismatch with the Kemper.
    The right hp were my in-ear Shure SE530, high end, excellent sounding, but not convenient for playing music.
    My son's cheap headphones were ok too , regarding the nasty frequencies problem.


    I would love to hear recommendations for headphones that work great with the Kemper.


    I also noticed that while the Bose and the Shure have the same impedance, the Bose was way quieter than the Shure.
    I had to put the Master Volume to 7 to match the Shure level that was set to 2.
    Thus I wonder if an headphones amp wouldn't just be the solution...

    Quote from lef38

    The *faulty* headphones were the Bose AE2 , although I had been satisfied with them until now


    If you're happy with the Bose AE2 sound when listening to well mixed and mastered music, they should be great for your guitar playing with the Profiler as well. There's absolutely no point in using headphones X for your Profiler to sound as good as your favorite music on headphones Y. :)

    Well I have ordered an headphones amp, they are known to produce a more natural sound, I will see.


    In the meantime, I'd love to hear which headphones you are using with the Kemper.

    Edited once, last by lef38 ().