A better STAR system?

    I think a great idea could be to make the rigs sortable by stars. Absolute number of stars, not average. This seems to be unfair only at the first glance.
    Because in order to give stars someone has to download it, audition it, download it again and THEN giving the stars.
    I recognized this, because the famous "Morgan" by pacheco, which is quite extraorninaire has in fact no perfect average, but a total sum of 142 STARS.
    And rightfully so. My own profile of a cream-marshall-clone which is appreciated by many has a total of 34 stars but a higher average.
    Some other profiles have the highest possible range of 5 STARS average with just one vote. This is not perfect and the sheer number of rigs is crushing and intimidates me.



    Comments?

    My occupation: showing teenagers the many hidden secrets of the A-minor chord on the guitar.

    I agree that the current sorting method isn't very good, but this doesn't seem like an improvement - with your idea, a really terrible rig that lots of people have tried and rated as 1 star would look much better than an awesome rig that only a few people have tried and given 5 stars.


    What about simply sorting by average number of stars, and then sorting *within* that by the number of users rating it. It would look like this:


    5 stars, 200 votes
    5 stars, 100 votes
    5 stars 30 votes
    5 stars, 2 votes
    4 stars, 180 votes
    4 stars, 100 votes
    4 stars, 10 votes
    3 stars, 300 votes
    etc...

    this would be a major improvement, agreed. right now you can find - if you sort the rigs via stars - even on the 16th page (sic!!) rigs with two votes for 5 stars.
    the search is so tiresome this way it is almost impossible. the thing with your idea is that we would need another column. and there is no place for this. and nobody
    here seems to know how to tune the website's software. this was the reason for my idea. if only one column is available, then this abolute number gives you a good hint.
    and: even the best rigs do no not have an average of five stars, some of the all-time-greats have 4.35 or similiar. so the best would - again - be sorted way later than those with
    5 stars average. it is difficult. nevertheless i would be happy with ANY improvement.

    My occupation: showing teenagers the many hidden secrets of the A-minor chord on the guitar.

    What about this, guys?


    I would split the "Rating" header in "Stars" and "Votes", and would then add the ability to make a hierarchical sorting to the page. Meaning that when you order by successive headers, the page remembers the sequence.
    This way, if we ordered by Votes first and then by Stars we'd get the Lokasenna criterion:

    5 stars, 200 votes
    5 stars, 100 votes
    4 stars, 180 votes
    4 stars, 100 votes
    3 stars, 300 votes


    Should we order by Stars first and then by Votes instead, we'd get the following:


    300 votes 5 stars
    200 votes 5 stars
    180 votes 4 stars
    100 votes 4 stars
    100 votes 3 stars


    I realize it's not perfect, but with a few clicks you'd rapidly get the situation in a more global way.


    What do you think? :)

    multo bene, gianfranco! :thumbup:


    this way - and it should be easy to write the code - you have solved the point i missed in Lokasenna's solution. The only thing that is
    bothering me: i am afraid no-one from the Kempers will chime in. Let's see.

    My occupation: showing teenagers the many hidden secrets of the A-minor chord on the guitar.

    Maybe the best help would be to have a "gain" ranking. Most of the time the rigs are called just by the Amps´s name or channel. That´s great. But I personally look out for example a good clean sound (1 or 2 GainLEDs) or a distorted sound that cleans up nicely (with my guitar that is with the gain about 8 to 10 LEDs). For this I am not into let´s say "Engl Distortion" or "Marshall Distortion". I am just looking for a good distorted sound whatever amp that might be. And I don´t necessarily look for the star ranking. The Gain setting would bring me closer to what I´m looking for than "this Bogner has 23 5 stars ratings". The addition "Lead" or "Rhythm" is a good hind but only a few users choose those in their rig names.
    And if there is a limited number of Columns in the RE, than I would get rid of "Cabinet" and change it to "Gain-Setting".


    Greetz

    My personal opinion is, that it would be wasted resources to tweak and cheat the existing system here and there a bit. Its foundation is just to bad to put more effort in it. Kemper should investigate if there's another, even better solution. I could imagine a few relatively simple means to improve the whole system ... but to be honest, I wouldn't do this for free. Maintaining a community forum and all the required tools around it (Rig Exchange) is quite some work.


    If Kemper is interested in serious (professional) help, they can always get in contact with me.
    I have MANY years of experience in web community administration.

    Quote from lightbox

    My personal opinion is, that it would be wasted resources to tweak and cheat the existing system here and there a bit.


    +1


    I think a better rating doesn't help. I played many 2-3 stars profile that are killer I think any many 4-5 star profiles that just suck.


    Over the top solution:
    Create automated MP3 clips for every submitted kipr. Shouldn't be too hard to realize with a DI track I think.

    MJT Strats / PRS Guitars / Many DIY Guitars -- Kemper Profiler Rack / Kemper Remote / InEar

    lightbox,


    i support everything you say, but we will not see the day the kempers give it to you soon ;) . Therefore i am looking for a modus vivendi
    and just a little improvement for the time being.

    My occupation: showing teenagers the many hidden secrets of the A-minor chord on the guitar.

    Quote from mDan

    Over the top solution:
    Create automated MP3 clips for every submitted kipr. Shouldn't be too hard to realize with a DI track I think.

    This! Awesome idea!

    My occupation: showing teenagers the many hidden secrets of the A-minor chord on the guitar.

    Slightly OT: Where does it come from, this urgent necessity to rate each and everything? By what quality criteria?
    I see it in a lot of fields: Germany's best nose surgeon, best this, best that, certified x and certified y. ;)
    While the certification often quietly only establishes standards that are inferior than what was there before and rankings don't reveal the validity of the criteria they're based upon.


    Still the best solution IMO is the personal RECOMMENDATION.
    And this holds true for all the threads I've seen so far about rigs.


    Rant over, sorry.




    P.S. Edited for spelling mistake.

    I completely agree with Ingolf here. A simple star rating isn't helpful at all.


    But there ARE things that would be helpful, for example:


    1. Ability to directly link to specific profiles from forum posts or Facebook or Twitter or whatever you feel appropriate.
    2. Directly discuss rigs and link demo recordings using the given rig.
    3. Some better search & filter options + the option for the rig creator to provide some more in-depth info on the rig

    Quote from Ingolf

    Still the gest solution IMO is the personal RECOMMENDATION.

    Absolutely. But i for instance asked the community which rig would suit BCC best and noone answered .
    plus: there is no decison between this (recommendation) or that (stars), it all piles up or would (haha :D ) pile up to the learning curve.
    stars would be to me just another part of the puzzle, no more no less.

    cheers

    My occupation: showing teenagers the many hidden secrets of the A-minor chord on the guitar.

    Edited once, last by Geraldo7 ().

    Quote from lightbox

    I completely agree with Ingolf here. A simple star rating isn't helpful at all.


    But there ARE things that would be helpful, for example:


    1. Ability to directly link to specific profiles from forum posts or Facebook or Twitter or whatever you feel appropriate.
    2. Directly discuss rigs and link demo recordings using the given rig.
    3. Some better search & filter options + the option for the rig creator to provide some more in-depth info on the rig


    Me and others have been asking for these and similiar features a couple of times. I have never received any reactions from the Kemper team concerning this topic. I mean they are usually totally reliable and do a good job, but when it comes down to change the RE and improve it, they don't even care enough to give you a reply to your suggestions. (and like I said sutff like this has been requested many times by different users -> no answer at all)

    Quote from KoMa

    Me and others have been asking for these and similiar features a couple of times. I have never received any reactions from the Kemper team concerning this topic. I mean they are usually totally reliable and do a good job, but when it comes down to change the RE and improve it, they don't even care enough to give you a reply to your suggestions. (and like I said sutff like this has been requested many times by different users -> no answer at all)

    two weeks ago posted. sad but true. no reply as usual. :|

    My occupation: showing teenagers the many hidden secrets of the A-minor chord on the guitar.

    Maybe the star system could be improved by integrating reviews that can be expanded upon clicking on a profile. Reason being it's so easy to click on a star rating and not furnish any explanation. Perhaps this would dissuade serial clickers, though I think the success of the system will eventually depend on users being more responsible while rating.


    If the rating is badly done (and this is so subjective), it will be impossible to conduct an objective assessment of the quality of sound. This would be irrespective of the number of stars or reviews.

    I like the idea of having an audio clip associated with the profile; not really big on the star system.... for every sound one guy will like and others won't... too much opinions... an audio clip reveals everything immediately.

    Gettin' funky up in here..

    Well, I'm not sure I'd agree on this. While I'd like the clips anyway, I've heard too many guitar players saying that after downloading a patch or profile they couldn't get the sound as in the clip they had been inspired by.
    Too many differences in touch, technique, guitars, PUs, sound systems...


    :)

    Quote from viabcroce

    Well, I'm not sure I'd agree on this. While I'd like the clips anyway, I've heard too many guitar players saying that after downloading a patch or profile they couldn't get the sound as in the clip they had been inspired by.
    Too many differences in touch, technique, guitars, PUs, sound systems...


    :)


    Exactly. One man's booze is another's poison.