The 'feel' - Kemper and Axe FX II

    Hey guys,



    For those owning both a Kemper and Axe Fx II: What unit has the better feel?
    I often read the Kemper excels at this. Is this still true? What are your experiences concerning the 'feel' of both units?
    I only tested the Kemper and compared to the 11R it was night and day difference :D


    Thanks!

    Just a question: Isn't the feel depending on music style as well? I often wonder why only few people state what kind of music they prefer to play. Isn't the feel different when you play bluesy stuff on the edge of breakup compared to thrash metal for example?

    I have been using the Axe-Fx for a long time. I have switched over to the Kemper and am now getting deeper into it and setting it up for my live gigs. what i can say is that it is MUCH easier and intuitive and satisfying to dial in a tone on the Kemper, and thus the tones i have been getting are much better than the axe. thats not to say its not possible with the axe, but i find i get so lost in the tweaking (and i have no problem staying focused for 6 hours straight) trying to find the sound i am looking for that it gets to diminishing returns and then your ears are fatigued and youre working against yourself. its much better to have the many actual knobs and parameters available to you right there, because things are interactive and crucially things change on a gig! with the axe it is set and forget- meaning you can forget about changing things on the fly. The Kemper has all the most important controls at your fingertips. thats a huge difference.
    Another thing I find much better about the Kemper is the way it deals with clean tones. every amp can easily run clean- thats brilliant. maybe someone will say thats also the case with the axe but not in my experience. actually i spent probably more than 24 hours of intense focus programming trying to get the fender twin model NOT to break up. in the end I felt it was a fragile compromise. I play jazz and modern music so for me its about expressive clean tones and crunched or boosted leads.
    I'm digging the Kemper and prefering it to the axe. I have the Axe-FX 2 side by side with the Kemper running into an Atomic CLR powered wedge. sounds amazing. On another note the thing i thought was going to be the downer with the Kemper is the effects. But i was wrong- the effects are great in the Kemper, although this is where the Kemper could use some improvement. But I really like how there are presets for the effects, on the axe there were no actual presets, just parameters that you had to tweak for each effects block. The effects sound great on the Kemper, although it could use more delay and reverb types and better real time parameter control.
    i hope this helps...


    k

    I had Ultra and II, now I have Kemper Powerhead. In my opinion is feel of Kemper way better as the competence, it feels like a good tube amp – I am talking about playing Kemper Powerhead with normal guitar cab at the home volume, I did not try it at the rehearsal/gig volume enough (only once with a cheap 4x12 cab that I played for the first time – and it sounded awesome) to talk about this part.


    After years of trying to achieve that Axe sounds and feels like a normal tube amp (tried a usual combinations: studio monitors, pa, few different ss and tube poweramps with guitar cab) I was very suspicious that a digital device can sound/feel like a good tube amp (I had/have Tone King Imperial, Suhr PT-100, Koch Twintone, Engl Blackmore/Steve Morse, Diezel Einstein, Diezel Hagen, Fender Supersonic, Marshall DSL ...). But, after I tried Kemper I was really surprised how good it sounds. The first try was simply to use it as a normal head with my pedalboard – only amp part, no Kemper-Effects. In only few minutes, without any tweaking, only searching for a profile I like, I could play! It sounded/felt awesome at the home volume! So since the first try it really replaced all my amps at home, and I play it a lot.


    So the next step will be to use it at rehearsal – for me that is the most critical use because the guitar sound need to come from the Powerhead, not through the PA. And the one step more will be to try it gigging with the Kemper, but here I am more relaxed because usually I have a monitor wedge and the amp on the stage need to be silent as possible, so I hear the miced amp – and Kemper can do it really well. The next recording sessions I will make with Kemper too, I do not see any problems here. :thumbup:


    my band: Ground Collapse

    Hi,


    As all AXE FX vs Kemper ... Sorry, but your question is a non-sens ... Post the same question on the fractal audio forum, and you'll get the opposite answer. My answer is simply ... If it is possible, let's try by yourself. The kemper is not sold by a dedicated channel, so it is possible to find one in a store to test it. If it "feels" like you want, and you prefer the "Kemper concept" instead of the "Axe" one ... just get it.


    For me, the Axe and the Kemper are two awesome devices, but they target different persons :
    - I want to spend time to get MY sound, without the nedd to have real amp -> Go to Axe (the number/quality of effects and the freedom of routing make the axe a far better tool than Kemper in this category)
    - I already have my tones, I just want a tool to make their use easier -> Go to Kemper (for me, many arstists and producers are in this category)
    - I don't have any amp, I just want to play by using the others peoples tones (with minimal tweaks) -> Also go to Kemper


    But this is my own opinion,


    Christophe

    Here’s my opinion, I use a FRFR monitor and go directly to the mains. For me, part of the “feel” is how the amp, modeler or profiler interact with the guitar, in other words, controlled feedback. I’ve owned a handful of the $500 modelers and the Axe II, I could get controlled feedback with any of them but they always seemed to require more volume and gain to get the same amount of feedback as my tube amps. But with the KPA I’m getting a much better controlled feedback with less gain and less volume, and the feedback is more full bodied and natural for lack of a better word, it quite simply feeds back more like a real tube amp than modelers do, IMHO. As far as dynamics, the Axe II and the KPA are pretty close, when picking softly or digging in they pretty much react exactly like a real tube amp does, but I would give the KPA a slight advantage in this department too, to me the picking dynamics of the KPA feel a bit more natural than the Axe II.

    Quote from ChristopheSeyler

    Hi,


    As all AXE FX vs Kemper ... Sorry, but your question is a non-sens ...


    I don't think it's nonsense, you just need to (as you pointed out) take all of replies with a grain of salt and consider the fact that people on the Kemper forum will obviously be in favor of the Kemper while people on the Fratal forum will obviously be in favor of the Axe II, but everyone's experience is still valid and I think it's good to talk about this stuff. You can pick up a Kemper from a major retailer with a 45 day return policy which is good, but you only get a 15 day return policy with the Axe II which in my experience is not nearly enough time to learn how to use it and make an informed decision if it is the right unit for you, at least it wasn't for me.

    Own both and really like both. My tone is largely based around an old Marshall JMP-1. Was easier to get those tones in and out of the Kemper, and it was also a breeze in the AxeFX by shooting an IR of my cab (which is like profiling the cab only) and pairing it with the JMP-1 model in the Axe (which is dead on accurate to the real thing).


    So, for basic tone each are brilliant. Feel wise, the Axe worked better for me as it had a little more immediacy in my particular case.


    If you are choosing between the two, the only thing I'd really suggest is to think through how important effects are to you. If you want more than just good set of basic effects, then the Axe gets my vote. If you are good with a basic set of excellent quality effects, the the Kemper is much easier to work with IMHO.


    Sorry man, but you this theory doesn't work. It's pretty common among some FAS users, but it is based on the assumption that a profile is a copycat of a someone else tone.
    That might work for matching eq's tone (which is how fast users think when they speak about the kpa) , but it doesn't at all with profiles taken by an amp.
    A profile is just a copy of an AMP with a certain eq/cab/mic settings, whit specific dynamics and behaviour. Guitar and hands, in a machine being as transparent as the KPA is, make a huge difference.
    While I agree the fact that the AF stuff is very flexible, I can confirm that the big amount of profiles available is the best way to find your tone. And it takes a lot of trying and tweaking in order to find what is best for you.


    In the end, I agree with you when you say that this question about the feel is not so useful, since feel is a very personal felling (nice and unwanted word trick), so it can have a good answer only after playing these devices, with a result of personal opinion.

    Quote from Jimmyno

    Sorry man, but you this theory doesn't work. It's pretty common among some FAS users, but it is based on the assumption that a profile is a copycat of a someone else tone.
    That might work for matching eq's tone (which is how fast users think when they speak about the kpa) , but it doesn't at all with profiles taken by an amp.
    A profile is just a copy of an AMP with a certain eq/cab/mic settings, whit specific dynamics and behaviour. Guitar and hands, in a machine being as transparent as the KPA is, make a huge difference.
    While I agree the fact that the AF stuff is very flexible, I can confirm that the big amount of profiles available is the best way to find your tone. And it takes a lot of trying and tweaking in order to find what is best for you.


    In the end, I agree with you when you say that this question about the feel is not so useful, since feel is a very personal felling (nice and unwanted word trick), so it can have a good answer only after playing these devices, with a result of personal opinion.

    What I mean is mainly that nature of the sound is the amp AND the cab (of course, pickup and fingers will affect it ... but it is difficult to change them, especially the fingers :D) ... The kemper would be more versatile with amp and cab profiled separately, because, like someone already said here, the algorithm chosen to remove the cab is not very perfect. I aslo agree that working like that, you should loose the interaction between amp, power amp and cab that the kemper can grab.


    The fact is playing with the tonestack parameters over a profile does not react like changing the same parameters on the profiled amp (this is why may profilers profiles their amps with different setting). For that, the AXE FX is better. Over that, the among of Cabinet IRs is so huge (just the Redwirez collection counts thousand of them). So a modeled amp and a IR collection give you a wider range of tweaking than a profile that becomes to sound a little wierd when to try to change the parameter to deeply.


    On the other hand, many amp+cab+mic have just some sweet spot. This is why I chosen the Kemper ... A good profile as starting base, a few tweaks and let's play (actually the reality is too many profile to test to get your good starting base :D) ... but i don't search weird sound with tons of FX or the perfect IR (or combinaison of IRs) to get THE tone.



    That is the thing , to me the kemper EQ is very musical...much better than the axe-fx IMO!
    Many times I would make a patch and after going thru IR's there always seemed to be something that I couldn't dial in or out with just basic EQ


    I think the whole 'mimic' thing is bollocks also.....you only have to look at the updates to see how many times things have been changed or 'corrected'
    I have played enough amps IRL and done side by side tests and its not close on the amps I have tried (no1 is the gain!!!!!)


    to the OP I own an ultra/II and the kemper and I think the feel is way better on the kemper
    I find with good profiles on the kemper I barely have to touch anything

    Love these comparison threads, even though I shouldn't ;)


    Here's my take on the feel-thing between the Axe and the Kemper.


    To sort of qualify my opinions: I've been using the Axe Ultra extensively for 2,5 years (ca 80-100 live gigs per year + a few studio sessions), using the Axe 2 the same way for about a year. I really dug how the Axe instantly replaced all the tones and fx I used live, and then some, and I really fast got used to hearing myself through FRFR monitors. I bought the Kemper 1,5 years ago and have been noodling with it at home while still using the Axe live.


    My eye (ear) opener was when I profiled a couple of my favourite amps (a Marshall and a Friedman) with the Kemper some six months ago. No fancy setup, just dialling in a good miked-up sound in my home studio with an SM57. This sounded incredible and I was stunned as to how great it felt to play through. The OP asks for a "feel" comparison, and precisely the "feel"-thing was what caught me here. I set the Kemper up with a midi board and used the Kemper's own effects, which also are great (although I would want a few more), and this rig effectively replaced my Axe almost overnight. To me, the Kemper with profiles of my amps dialled in the way I like them, with my guitars, sounds nothing short of freaking amazing.


    A couple of weeks ago, I brought my Axe to the gig, sort of to compare and see if I'm in some kind of honeymoon phase with the Kemper. Again, this is imho: The Axe, as good as it is with effects and routability, sounded way flatter and less three-dimensional, if that makes sense, compared to the Kemper. I worked for hours with the Axe, browsing through my entire Ownhammer library of IRs, changing amps, etc. but I couldn't get close to the 3D swhirl and warmth of my Kemper profiles.


    So, as for that warm, punchy and responsive 3D amp feel, the Kemper wins for me. And to me, the basic sound of the amp is the most important.


    I'm not making big empirical claims here, this is based on my preferences, what I'm looking for in an amp. I'm sure a lot of people will chime in with more or less the same arguments in favour of the Axe, and that's great. But I'm sure a lot of people would listen for and hear the same things that I hear too.


    What I haven't done with the Axe, which I probably should do, is to shoot my own IRs and perhaps even tonematch my amps. That will have to come later, now I must find a great tweed amp and profile that with my Strat and Les Paul ;)

    i would be happy with either one, but i find the kemper feels more like the real thing. the axe (I or II) sounds somwhat flat / one-dimensional. i think it is due to the IR/cab section

    Quote from kojak_

    i would be happy with either one, but i find the kemper feels more like the real thing. the axe (I or II) sounds somwhat flat / one-dimensional. i think it is due to the IR/cab section


    The IRs are extremely important, and I have yet to shoot my own IRs for my Axe. Still, I've tested a gazillion IRs (Redwires, Ownhammers, Fractal Audios, different downloaded from forum members etc.) and many of those are really great. But I can't get rid of that flatness, for the lack of a better word, in the sound, no matter what IR I use. To me, the Kemper seems to win when it comes to tone, complexity, gain structure etc. The Axe is great, though, and I'm sure that what I hear as "flat," some will find desirable.