Dear God - I hope it gets better than this!

Quote from Tritium

Okay, here is what I see possibly happening.

Even though the OP has a perfectly good M-B Roadster amp and a couple of Thiel Cabs, he appears reluctant to test his KPA with it. Instead of waiting around for the UPS driver to deliver his Yammy DXR10...he could at least try the KPA with the Roadster (as power amp) and Thiel Cab. If I had such a terrible first impression experience with my new KPA using headphones, I wouldn't hesitate in immediately trying an alternative KPA set-up and implementation...especially when all the equipment is right at hand. But that is just me.

I mean, there is a possibility, however small, that FRFR will not be the OP's cup of tea. Now, I certainly hope that he does love his KPA with an FRFR setup, as I think that the full power and benefits of the Kemper are realized in a FRFR based setup. Nevertheless, the fact remains that there are some guitarists that can never successfully make the transition and paradigm shift to FRFR and the whole "amp through mic'd cab" sound. At least with the tube amp + traditional guitar cabinet setup, you have a bonafide backup plan...should the whole FRFR thing not be your cup of tea.

Cheers,
John

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That's partially true. I am reluctant to test it with the Mesa because that is my second choice in terms of how I want to use this. The main reason I bought the Kemper, was to get a variety of amps, (with high quality sound) and be able to lessen the amount of gear I'm carrying around to gigs. By the time I get home from work each night, play with my daughter, have dinner, I have limited time to do much with the Kemper during the week. So rather than rush it, I'm going to wait until I get my Yamaha (which will be tomorrow). I've got a gig tomorrow night, but I'm off all of Saturday and Sunday and will spend the majority of those 2 days with this new setup. If during those 2 days, my impression of the Kemper doesn't change, then I'll try it through my Mesa's power amp. If I end up liking that sound, then I'll keep the Kemper, return the Yamaha, sell my Mesa Roadster and just buy a rackmount poweramp (maybe a Fryette Power Station) and use it with my Thiel cabs. That again, is my second option because in that scenario, I'm not going to be taking full advantage of the true profiles the way they were meant to be. But if I get to that scenario at all, it's because I felt the profiles sounded like crap live through the Yamaha (which I'm hoping won't be the case). Plus, if I go the route of using it with a power amp and cabs, then it doesn't really lighten my load all that much, which was part of the reason I bought this.

So between now and Saturday, I'm just focusing on making sure the firmware is up to date, enabling Pure Cab, and making all the little tweaks like that which are recommended, as well as downloading a bunch of high quality, recommended profiles (the Tim Owens stuff, some of the free Amp Factory presets, the free Michael Britt 20-pack, and some of the profiles that are free on the Kemper rig exchange that have been recommended to me). So then on Saturday, all that stuff will be out of the way and I can just go straight to the high quality profiles and see how they sound. If none of them work for me, then I'll try the Mesa setup. If that doesn't work, then I'm just returning everything and sticking with my Mesa rig.

My preference would be for the Yamaha setup to blow me away. Because then I could get rid of my Mesa Roadster, my 2 thiel cabs, my G-System and a few other pedals that are no longer needed. Selling all that stuff alone will pay for my Kemper and Yamaha. And I'll have a much lighter and more portable rig. Just swapping the G-System with the Kemper controller would be a significant weight drop in itself. So believe me, I've got a ton of different reasons why I want this Kemper setup to work. I'm not worried at all about missing the "pushed air" feel from cabs, because 1x12 cabs don't push much air to begin with. So going from a 1x12 cab to a 1x10 speaker, shouldn't be TOO big of a difference. For me, it's more about volume and being able to hear my sound loud and clear on stage than it is having it push air back at me.

Quote from Horspip

@OhG, I thought I'd tell you about my experiences as a fairly new Kemper owner, as my previous set up was fairly similar.
Prior to the Kemper, my gigging setup was a Mesa Roadster combo, rack case containing some pedals and 19" rack effects, plus a Voodoo Lab GCX MIDI switcher (before that I had a G System). On the floor, I had a Ground Control, more pedals, a wah, expression pedal, tuner and tap tempo switch. I loved the sound of this set-up and used it for a variety of very different projects. In fact, I was never going to sell that amp. But it was SO much to carry around, and SO heavy!
Anyway, I was playing in Brighton last summer and had most of the day free so I went into the local music shop and spent about 2 hours playing their demo powered Kemper, straight into a Marshall 4x12. It sounded so good that I decided then and there to replace everything I owned with a Kemper.
Here's the point: I decided to buy the non-powered Kemper as I didn't have a cab, plus I wanted the sound of all of those cabs in FRFR, too, so I chose the DXR10. The first few days, playing through dozens of profiles, I was in heaven - completely certain that I'd made the right decision. However, the first gig was really disappointing. I was so used to the sound of my beloved Roadster behind me that the Kemper/DXR10 just didn't feel right. Clean sounds were amazing, plus the punch, clarity and spread of sound, but I found the overdriven and distorted tones weren't right at all.
I experimented a lot, including listening through headphones (which I disliked and still do) plugging into my old Sony hi-fi (sounds absolutely great!), other PAs, and eventually borrowed a 2x12 cab, which I used with an old solid state power amp.
And there was the sound! It seems I just preferred the sound of a guitar cab. I'm probably a Luddite, but there you go! I love my Kemper; it gets better the more I get to know it and I make notes after every gig and then tweak little things the next day and it gets better still!
I now use it with a DV Mark Neoclassic 2x12 and a Palmer Macht 402 power amp. On the floor is a Kemper Remote and a Dunlop DVP3 pedal and I have more versatility, more control and better guitar sounds than I've ever had.
I suppose the point of this is that the Kemper is capable of being whatever you want it to be; it might just take a little experimentation to bring it out. It takes a little time to get to know how it will work best for you but it's most definitely worth it, in my humble opinion.

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Thanks Horspip. Like you said, it sounds like you and I come from similar situations. I'm getting my DXR today, but won't have time to sit with it until tomorrow (gig tonight). But I plan to spend all weekend doing nothing but Kemper stuff, and deciding whether or not to keep it. I've done a factory reset, which SEEMS to have helped with the pre-loaded profile sounds a little bit. I've installed the latest firmware, and now have over 2,000 profiles ready to sort through this weekend. I'd really prefer not to have to use a cab with this, because from what I've been told, it'll reduce the Kemper's effectiveness by not having a FRFR setup. But I'll give that a try if the DXR doesn't work out. But I need to decide within the next couple weeks because that's when my return period expires. And I don't want to be stuck with a new Kemper and/or a new Yahama DXR if they aren't exactly what I'm looking for. If the sound ends up being equal to, or less than what I have right now with my Mesa, it makes no sense to keep any of it. I drool over the idea of being able to have so many amps available to me in one small rack. But I'm the type that needs to hear it for myself before I can believe it. (c:

Quote from paults

Pure Cabinet is not in version 3.02 Your KPA is not completely up to date.

Install the 3.2.1 release software, and you will have Pure Cab available in the Output Menu.

Thanks paults. That worked. I also did a system reset before installing the latest firmware and that seems to have helped with the sound a LITTLE (or maybe it's just me). But I do now have access to Pure Cab. I'll see how that sounds tomorrow with my DXR10. Using the Pure Cab and Space feature helped improve the tones in headphones.

Quote from JHERCULEES1

no offense ves medic but
I think its ok hes starting a thread about this . The kemper is an expensive piece of gear and after spending 2 grand he has a right to post in the forum and ask for help if he is not getting a tone he likes , please lets not turn this into a fractal forum where any1 who blasphemes the kemper gets stoned

Thank you for typing exactly what I was thinking when I first saw that post. The whole point of this forum is to help people with their Kempers, especially the new owners who come here looking for advice.

Quick update. I finally had a chance to try my DXR with the Yamaha. HUUUUUUUGE improvement over the headphones! Much of my skepticism has been eliminated now. I'm still in the phase of deciding whether or not to keep it, but unlike earlier in the week, I'm now leaning more in the direction of keeping the Kemper than not. As everyone has said, finding the right profiles is key. There are some profiles out there (including some that are factory installed) that make me think Helen Keller created them. And then there are others that sound REALLY good.

I'm going to spend the rest of today and some time tomorrow working on things, but I just wanted to post a quick follow-up to everyone who helped talk me off the ledge. I'm really liking the direction this is going.

Quote from VESmedic

Everyone is entitled to their opinion... My opinion is that there is LITERALLY pages and pages and Pages of threads of this exact scenario all over this forum, as well as countless others...you gotta help yourself before others can help you, just the way I look at it. If I have a problem, I'll be doing MY part of trying to figure out the issue first before I come asking someone for help. Chances are, I'm not the first person who has had the problem im having and chances are really good there is info about said problem... Feel free to disagree...

I'm don't want to sound like a jerk when saying this, but not everyone uses a forum the same way, or even the same purpose. FYI, I did try using the search function on this site, but IMO, it's often more annoying than helpful because it either brings up nothing if the search criteria is too specific, or WAY too much irrelevant info, with many duplicate threads shown, if the search criteria isn't detailed enough. And in some cases, due to the evolution of the KPA through firmware releases and people just learning more about it, some of those existing responses aren't even the most accurate responses anymore. So for people like me, who have a limited time to actually test the KPA out and make a decision as to whether or not to keep it, starting a thread to get a relevant response makes sense rather than searching through countless, and sometimes no longer relevant threads.

I've had my KPA less than a week. But even though I've read both manuals (twice, now), I can guarantee you that I'm going to have more questions, and in all likelihood, they're "newb-ish" questions that have already been asked at some point on this forum. But if a thread doesn't interest you, nobody is forcing you to open it, read it or comment in it. I'm sure you probably had some very similar questions when you first got yours. And while you may have found your answers in a different way, that doesn't necessarily work for everyone (hence, the point of an open forum). And a thread does prove to be pointless or redundant, it'll quickly fade off the main page of the forum. So this really shouldn't be much of an issue unless someone is spamming the boards, which is obviously not the case here. But the fact that this thread has over 3,300 views shows that enough people were interested enough in it to warrant it being on the forum, whether it be to provide answers, or because they may have had some of the same questions.

This forum has proven to be without a doubt the most helpful resource I've found when it comes to the Kemper. The people on here are awesome. So as long as I'm able to get answers from it, I'm going to continue using it in whatever way is most useful to me. Eventually, I'll have enough experience with the KPA to be on the other side and helping other newbs out.