Thin sound!! (again!!! hahahaha... But this time with more research)

    So I obviously come back here and make threads about "MY KEMPER SOUNDS THIN!" and aparently there's a good reason for it!!!


    Here's a stock SinMix profile. It sounds thin, and so does all my other profiles on my Kemper. I use standard low and high-pass filter settings as I would when recording a real tube amp.

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    Here is the same profile with CAB OFF on the Kemper, and then using IRs in Cubase instead. THIS SOUNDS MUCH FULLER! It has the same high and low-pass settings as the stock cab, but it doesn't make it go completely thin and useless.

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    And definitely MUCH CLOSER to my wanted guitar sound, I have Grave Digger as reference track when trying to dial in the sound, and I have struggled with this... ALL STOCK PROFILES are thin and useless, while if I turn "CAB OFF" and use IRs, I get a LOT closer to this!!!!

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    So, what the hell is wrong with my Kemper? Obviously the DI tracks with IRs work, but I dont necessarly wanna use that, I wanna use Kemper alone, and not put additional weight on my recording projects with IRs and stuff for all guitar tracks...


    Does the Kemper secretely has some sort of built-in high and low-pass filter? :S8|:pinch::wacko:


    My guess...you are sucking all the tone out your profile/mix with your specific KPA settings for the high and low pass filters.


    I have played many Sinmix KPA profiles...and I have not found even one to be "thin".

    Quote from Michael_dk

    have you tried using kemper's CabMaker app to convert that IR to kemper format, and see if that changes anything? (that way, you can load the IR into the kemper as a cab)


    Might help troubleshooting.


    Yeah I will try that!



    Quote from Tritium

    My guess...you are sucking all the tone out your profile/mix with your specific KPA settings for the high and low pass filters.


    I have played many Sinmix KPA profiles...and I have not found even one to be "thin".


    I have never found any high-pass or low-pass filter in KPA.
    Honestly it's a recently fresh factory reset so unless Kemper themselves put high and low pass in there, I have not touched anything at all.

    Quote from Cederick

    I have never found any high-pass or low-pass filter in KPA.
    Honestly it's a recently fresh factory reset so unless Kemper themselves put high and low pass in there, I have not touched anything at all.


    Hi Cederick,


    When you say you used your normal high pass and low pass filters, I assumed you mean't one of the EQ effects (such as Studio EQ) in the KPA, and adding it one of the KPA effect blocks. Based on your reply, I take it that is not the case...that is you are not using any EQ effects on your KPA. So, what are the HP and LP filters? Are they plug-ins for your DAW?


    Cheers,
    John

    No, I never done that.


    When I record a tube amp with microphone, I usually low and highpass in my DAW.


    I am expecting to do the same with Kemper profiles, since they are just recorded with a microphone, just like I would normally do with a real tube amp and cab.


    I mean, EVERY PROFILE has this thinny quality to it... But once I use a IR on my DAW everything sounds full and good


    When you say "every profile" has a thin quality, can you be more specific. What are you playing your KPA through, in terms of speakers / monitors??

    Quote from Cederick

    I'm just comparing to other recordings, both bands I like, and recording I've done myself with various real tube amps.


    All within my DAW making sure everything goes through the same speakers and stuff


    Understood. Okay, here is another question.


    Have you ever used your KPA to make your own Studio profile of one of your amps? If so, have you directly compared a recording of the KPA profile (on your DAW), with a separate recording of the the same reference tube amp, which has been recorded with the same microphone and cabinet?

    To me (and forgive me if I'm way off the mark here; when I listen to audio off the Internet at work, it comes through my crappy "reference for tv" tiny mono speaker) it sounds as if most of the low/low-mid energy in the Gravedigger track is coming from the bass, as I would expect of a rock mix. Your own recording sounds like it's lacking any kind of bass guitar. Have you tried dubbing a bass and giving it some energy in the 300 Hz region, maybe even a bit of drive from an amp sim? I think you'd find the guitars automatically would sound a lot closer to the original recording.

    might be me but I like the first two sample more. they cut through the mix in a much better way. it all depends on what you want to achieve: a guitar alone tone....or a guitar tone that suits the song.


    given this I wouldn't reject the first two samples.


    that's my 2 cents

    "...why being satisfied with an amp, as great as it can be, while you can have them all?" michael mellner


    "Rock in Ecclesia" - new album on iTunes or Google music

    Quote from sambrox

    To me (and forgive me if I'm way off the mark here; when I listen to audio off the Internet at work, it comes through my crappy "reference for tv" tiny mono speaker) it sounds as if most of the low/low-mid energy in the Gravedigger track is coming from the bass, as I would expect of a rock mix. Your own recording sounds like it's lacking any kind of bass guitar. Have you tried dubbing a bass and giving it some energy in the 300 Hz region, maybe even a bit of drive from an amp sim? I think you'd find the guitars automatically would sound a lot closer to the original recording.


    This!!!

    Quote from sambrox

    To me (and forgive me if I'm way off the mark here; when I listen to audio off the Internet at work, it comes through my crappy "reference for tv" tiny mono speaker) it sounds as if most of the low/low-mid energy in the Gravedigger track is coming from the bass, as I would expect of a rock mix. Your own recording sounds like it's lacking any kind of bass guitar. Have you tried dubbing a bass and giving it some energy in the 300 Hz region, maybe even a bit of drive from an amp sim? I think you'd find the guitars automatically would sound a lot closer to the original recording.


    Quote from michaelmellner

    might be me but I like the first two sample more. they cut through the mix in a much better way. it all depends on what you want to achieve: a guitar alone tone....or a guitar tone that suits the song.


    given this I wouldn't reject the first two samples.


    that's my 2 cents




    I just made a new recording! And this time 100% Kemper WITHOUT highpass or lowpass!


    And it sounds very close to the original song.
    First is the original song, then I just mimic the riffs until the song starts.

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    If I would have highpass or lowpass, it would sound just as thin as I described and showd in the earlier post

    Quote from Cederick

    I just made a new recording! And this time 100% Kemper WITHOUT highpass or lowpass!


    And it sounds very close to the original song.
    First is the original song, then I just mimic the riffs until the song starts.

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    If I would have highpass or lowpass, it would sound just as thin as I described and showd in the earlier post


    Hi Cederik,


    Glad you worked it out to your satisfaction. You might want to edit the title of this thread with the notice "Solved", so everyone knows.


    Cheers,
    John

    It's not solved at all!


    I contacted SinMix and he had no clue.


    He sent me a new profile so I could try to reamp with it.


    His and mide sounds COMPLETELY DIFFERENT!


    And as I have said a million time,s my KEMPER SOUNDS THIN! THERE'S SOME
    THING ABSOLUTELY WRONG WITH IT :(



    Here's SinMix own reamp with my DI track I sent to him:

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    And this is my reamp:
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    My reamp sounds THIN AND SHITTY