Help with my mix

    Hey guys,
    Looking for some help with this mix. What would you have done differently?


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    I got some great tips from @Dean_R and @MentaL to clear up somewhat, but I feel there could be more clarity in general. So while I have some ideas, I'd like to know a few things like:


    1) Could the reverb have been done more tastefully?


    2) Do the guitars need a tube screamer in front of the amp?


    3) I have hi passed the low frequencies on the guitar quite sparingly. It's in B tuning, so I was scared I would completely kill the bottom end. Should I have been more aggressive?


    4) Does it need more bass? I high-passed the bass as well to give the kick more prominence? Wrong decision?


    5) Any other mixing tips you could spare for a rank amateur would be appreciated. I know I need to redo the vocals, so didn't mix them too high.

    Just MHO's based upon single pass-through on my craptastic MacCrap™ (mono) speaker, AJ:


    The vocals could do with more clarity and levelling. More high end and more-even volume, IOW... and a dB or a little more volume too.


    Rhythm guitar could be a smidgen closer.


    Anything related to bass or the guitars' HPF cutoff point cannot be judged (or even heard!) on this completely-bass-absent speaker, I'm afraid.


    Overall, good job so far, man!


    Thanks, Nicky. I need to redo the vocals, they lacked punch, I think I need some processing in the signal chain too.


    When you say the rhythm guitar needs to be closer, you mean more forward in the mix? Any idea how I could do that? Is it because of too much reverb?

    Yeah, more-forward. It's probably the level of the early-reflection component of the 'verb, AJ, as well as the overall amount used.


    Try dialling the 'verb send from the rhythm guitar back a tad and you'll notice it'll move closer to the front. I can't hear the tail on my CrapMac™ speaker, but if it's long, shorten it too; it'll only serve to add mud to the mix.


    I'm not suggesting bringing it all the way forward obviously; that space should be reserved for lead vox, but rather just a little behind that - say, half-way between the vox and drum-kit depth. Bear in mind that we're talking about a fairly-shallow spread here. Fast-paced pieces of this ilk aren't served well by long 'verb tails or having the instruments distanced by more than, oh I don't know, 5 metres on the virtual sound stage (just guessing, but you get the idea - not much).

    Some very quick notes:


    1) the drums are not balanced against themselves - I think the snare needs to be more upfront (and could do with more fatness and crack), and the cymbals definitely need to brought way down - as well as the toms.


    2) I think the bass needs to come through much more. For music such as this, I think the kick needs the click, the bass needs the bottom. Remember, half the guitar tone comes from the bass :)


    3) I think the guitars need a bit less gain - they're a bit too fizzy i think.


    4) you say you've not turned up the vocals because they need to be redone - but it makes it hard to come with any further pointers re. clarity between vocals and guitars.

    Quote from Monkey_Man

    Yeah, more-forward. It's probably the level of the early-reflection component of the 'verb, AJ, as well as the overall amount used.


    Try dialling the 'verb send from the rhythm guitar back a tad and you'll notice it'll move closer to the front. I can't hear the tail on my CrapMac™ speaker, but if it's long, shorten it too; it'll only serve to add mud to the mix.


    I'm not suggesting bringing it all the way forward obviously; that space should be reserved for lead vox, but rather just a little behind that - say, half-way between the vox and drum-kit depth. Bear in mind that we're talking about a fairly-shallow spread here. Fast-paced pieces of this ilk aren't served well by long 'verb tails or having the instruments distanced by more than, oh I don't know, 5 metres on the virtual sound stage (just guessing, but you get the idea - not much).


    I panned the guitars hard left and hard right. Would it make more sense to pan them only partly? I'll try out your verb send suggestion, hopefully that will help too.




    Thanks for the inputs, Michael.
    1) I was trying BFD3 for the drums. Just a bit of compression and EQ on various kit pieces. Perhaps I will try Superior Drummer on my next mix through, the drums are more clicky. I'll try blending too to get a more full-bodied snare sound.


    2) On the bass: I kind of got the feeling it was too low, I was trying to avoid the mix from being too bass heavy. I'll raise the level and try more EQ and compression to tame it. Will also make sure that the kick "click" is more prominent.


    3) I wonder whether I've recorded them too hot. What would be a suggested input level for a reamped guitar signal? About -12db?


    4) At this stage, I'm keen to glean as much information I can get on how to mix better. This mix was much better than most of the other stuff I've done, but I'll be sure to post back when I've redone the vocals so that I can get more feedback.

    Quote from nightlight

    1) I was trying BFD3 for the drums. Just a bit of compression and EQ on various kit pieces. Perhaps I will try Superior Drummer on my next mix through, the drums are more clicky. I'll try blending too to get a more full-bodied snare sound.

    The brand of software shouldn't be a concern. just level the individual tracks in relation to each other - get the individual volumes correct before working on EQ and compression etc. I can recommend having a song in the same genre open (that you like the sound of) and listening to how the drums are balanced.



    Quote from nightlight

    3) I wonder whether I've recorded them too hot. What would be a suggested input level for a reamped guitar signal? About -12db?

    I don't know that there is any kind of "suggested level". You just go for what sounds right.
    I wouldn't worry too much about the guitar fizz for now (it could probably be helped a bit by some EQing) - concentrate on the drums first and foremost :)

    Quote from Michael_dk

    The brand of software shouldn't be a concern. just level the individual tracks in relation to each other - get the individual volumes correct before working on EQ and compression etc. I can recommend having a song in the same genre open (that you like the sound of) and listening to how the drums are balanced.


    I don't know that there is any kind of "suggested level". You just go for what sounds right.I wouldn't worry too much about the guitar fizz for now (it could probably be helped a bit by some EQing) - concentrate on the drums first and foremost :)


    That makes sense. It's not so much a worry about software as getting the right sound. BFD has a more natural sound I find, particularly the cymbals. But the drums just aren't clicky. I'm sure I could get that with BFD with better EQing, but having it sound that way out of the box is probably a better bet. And since I have both, I will try blending to see if I can get both more body as well as more punch.


    What I meant was the input level for best results when mixing. I tend to prefer a louder signal, without clipping, and then cut rather than boost the signal. But that could also reduce my headroom, so next time around, I'll try reducing my SPDIF volume when reamping by some amount.


    I hear you on focusing on the drums, I'll work on that after I have done the vocals. Many thanks.

    Quote from sinmix

    @nightlight send me multitrack with DI guitars, i can try to mix this song my way... just for fun.


    Stay Metal!


    Woah! Thanks, Sin! I'll do that tonight. PM me your email address and I'll send you the guitar tracks, the bass tracks and the drum midi file if that's cool with you. Would be great to hear what a professional makes of it. Thank you!

    Hi Nightlight, here is my feedback on the mix.


    Vocals need more clarity and not so buried in the mix, I know some bands like their vocals low but I think this is too low.


    The drums need more punch and definition they need to be the solid bas of the mix. I would give the kick more click like has been mentioned above.


    The guitars are very fizzy and thin LPF the top end and EQ a little more to obtain this, maybe even use a different profile if you have the dry tracks to do this with of course


    Bass guitar, this is always a pain to get right and is my daily struggle when mixing lol for big guitar sounds the bass guitar always plays a big roll, I would maybe give it a little more low end not HPF it so much.


    Reverb = on a track like this you want to avoid to much reverb as this will just clutter your mix. I always HPF and LPF my reverbs to help keep the mix clear and clean but still give a sense on space in the mix especially fast music like this. I think this mix has far to much reverb and maybe the wrong kind to start with


    I'm no pro at mixing at all buddy and I'm just sharing my own opinions on the mix, anyway keep working on it and I'm sure your mixes will get better and better :)

    Quote from nightlight

    Thanks for the feedback, Raoul. I use reamping when I record, so perhaps I will try a different profile if these have too much gain on them.


    Also, good advice on the bass. I will not HPF so much and raise the level.


    I think I would have been better off with the Kemper reverbs than the ones in Logic, will give that a try next time.

    I don't know what the reverbs are like in Logic, never used it lol I never record guitars with reverb on I always do that in post production and use an AUX track so I can insert that same reverb on many different instruments (makes them sound like then all share the same space) My fav in pro tools is Revibe

    Have you tried sending the bass through a separate bus with Overdrive on it? This can be nice as you can then blend in the two sounds, usually only a little of the od to add depth and grunt.


    It might not work on this track but could sound good.

    Yes, and HPF that blended-in overdrive version so as not to risk any phase cancellation with the low end of the bass, which can thin it out / make it more light-weight.


    Quote from nightlight

    I panned the guitars hard left and hard right. Would it make more sense to pan them only partly? I'll try out your verb send suggestion, hopefully that will help too.

    My MacCrap™ speaker's mono, AJ, so I'm reluctant to make a judgement on the panning, bud.


    I do believe that shortening 'verb tails for faster-paced programme material is the way to go. Don't be afraid to remove the tails altogether and use only the early-reflection component of the 'verb either.