Kemper-forum Etiquette Tips

  • Just some things I find mildly-annoying, off the top of my head. I've probably overlooked some obvious points as I hadn't planned this. I hope it does some good at any rate, and sincerely hope I don't come off as a fuddy-duddy.



    1) Respect the mods. They're the landlords and housekeepers. 'Nuff said.


    2) Split information-rich, seemingly-endless blocks of sentences into paragraphs. This makes it much-easier to navigate, read and even figure out what they're all about at a glance.


    3) Don't be afraid to use the magic words in your thread titles as well as opening "statements" of issues at hand. Good manners go a long way, and apart from helping to maintain the friendly-and-courteous vibe here, won't do your attempts to elicit help from the forum any harm at all either.


    4) Make some sort of effort to look up rudimentary facts in the manuals before inviting others to do so for you, especially as the PDFs allow for quick-and-easy searching, unlike hard-copy manuals. Of this we should be grateful IMHO.


    5) Afterthoughts should be added to posts either on the quiet or under a heading such as, "EDIT" (that's what the "button" is for), as opposed to their constituting multiple, consecutive additional posts. It clutters the forum, wastes space, and IMHO it's far-easier to read someone's input as a series of sentences or paragraphs in one post than across numerous ones. The logical extension of such a mentality is to make every sentence an individual post. No point venturing even one step down that road.


    6) If a question can be asked on the forum, especially if it's one that logically many would benefit from seeing, don't PM someone to ask it. This is what the forum's for; it's the Kemper-support forum. PMs are for everything else. Just 'cause someone's obviously spent a lot of time posting here, it doesn't follow that he or she is automatically at the ready to answer support questions from all and sundry.


    7) Treat everyone with (equal) respect. Lack of talent, experience (or both) and lengthy CVs mean nothing here. Try to judge requests and opinions on their merits and not through a lens that filters so-called big guns from noobs. We're a family, a community with several passions in common at least, and all members deserve the best-possible treatment we're able to deliver.


    8 ) Off-topic musings should remain brief and indirectly-relevant, at the very least, and should be avoided as much as is humanly-possible in the troubleshooting sub-forums such as the "Feature Requests", "Share Tips and Tricks", "Profiler-related Discussions", "Profiler-related Issues and Trouble-shooting Help" and "Rig Manager - Librarian Software" ones.


    There's obviously more scope for straying a little in the "Free Rigs and Profiles", "Commercial Rigs and Profiles" (banter between customers and vendors or opinion-sharing of merchandise, for instance), "Link Your Music", "Website and Forum discussion", "Introduce Yourself" and the "Other Gear" sub-forums, as none of these relates directly to trouble-shooting of the KPA, the primary purpose of the forum.


    9) Don't be afraid to use emoticons to help clarify possibly-ambiguous statements, humorous or otherwise. We all know that the printed word, especially in the hands of luddites such as myself, can at times fall a long way short of conveying one's true intentions.


    10) Feature requests: Helping the OP by pointing out ways of achieving what he or she wants, or questions to elicit more-clearly what he or she seeks, are great, but try to refrain from posting why you don't think a feature is necessary. This doesn't add value. Just because you don't think a feature is necessary doesn't mean it might not be a real need for other people.


    11) Use descriptive topic titles - not just "please help" etc. Describing the problem briefly in the title is courteous in that it saves folks from wasting their time reading posts with which they can't identify at all. Further to this, doing so is likely to attract input from those who might otherwise have overlooked the topic, not having realised what the thread was all about.


    12) Pull out of discussions early if they appear to be going nowhere or get personal in nature. You are only adding fuel to the fire. Be the bigger man or woman and stop responding. It annoys the silent majority when these things go on and on.


    13) Don't let frustration lead you to bash Kemper products or the company; it detracts from the cooperative atmosphere we have here and will only get you less help and derail the thread. Vent elsewhere, such as via private messaging.


    14) Give other people the benefit of the doubt when they point to potential flaws or problems with their Kempers.


    15) Be specific regarding signal chains when troubleshooting, and try the things suggested. Quote the post with the suggestions you've tried and report the results. People spend a lot of time helping others on this forum, so please respect that time.


    16) The use of capital letters is the equivalent of shouting. Please be aware of this as most folks don't appreciate receiving an ear bashing.


    17) Try to keep your sentences, syntax and chosen words simple when speaking to members for whom English is not their first language and who're obviously struggling with self-expression and comprehension. It's usually obvious to native-English speakers when this is the case, and not making any effort to accommodate the circumstances is, frankly, insensitive and arguably-rude.


    18) If you're the first responder to a post, there's no need to quote it. If it's a long one, it makes sense to quote only the relevant part/s you're addressing for the sake of clarity. Some folks seem to use the "generic" (button) option by default in these situations, even when it results in a bird's nest of quotes, pictures or both. For one thing, how are readers supposed to know what's being responded to? Further to this, it's a waste of space.


    A suggestion might be to drag the mouse over the pieces of text you'd like to quote, and select "Save Quote" or "Insert Quote". This way, even afterthoughts can be catered for by first positioning the cursor where you'd like an insertion to occur and then implementing one of the aforementioned actions.



    If I think of any more issues to add, I'll do so to this OP. Maybe I'll run the thread using the same layout as the wah one, but as a "reference" only, for those for whom this whole inter-webs thingy's a new-fangled experience.


    Thank you for reading, beloved Kemperites!


    PS: Any suggestions are of course encouraged and welcome, and please correct me if I'm way off the mark with any that I've already put forward, dear Kemperites and mods.

  • Hy MonkeyMan!


    I agree with most of what you said. Some comments:

    I think the original "can somebody help" is fine, personally :-) but courtesy is always appreciated.


    5) Afterthoughts should be added to posts either on the quiet or under a banner such as, "EDIT" (that's what the "button" is for), as opposed to their constituting additional posts. It clutters the forum, wastes space, and IMHO it's far-easier to read someone's input as a series of sentences or paragraphs than across numerous posts. The logical extension of such a mentality is to make every sentence an individual post. No point venturing even one step down that road.

    Hmm... I'm a bit on the fence on this. If further posts have been made / it is likely that many/relevant people have already read the original post, I think it's fine to add a new post, to avoid the information getting lost. However, if no other posts have been made since your last one please just edit it instead of making a new one (which I have been guilty of on occasion too :-)).



    Some more ideas:


    Feature requests: Helping the OP by pointing out ways of achieving what they want, or questions to elicit more clearly what they seek, are great - but try to refrain from posting why you don't think it's a necessary feature. That doesn't add value; just because YOU don't think it's a necessary feature, it might be a real need to other people.


    Use descriptive topic titles - not just "please help" etc etc. Describe the problem briefly in the title when seeking help.


    Pull out of discussions early that are going nowhere or get personal in nature. You are only adding fuel to the fire. Be the bigger man/woman and stop responding. It annoys the silent majority when these things go on and on.


    Don't let frustration lead you to bash the kemper or the company. It doesn't help create a cooperative atmosphere and will only get you less help and derail the thread. Vent elsewhere.


    Give other people the benefit of the doubt when they point to a potential flaw or problem with (their) kemper.


    Bes specific regarding signal chains when troubleshooting, and try the things suggested. Quote the post with the suggestions and report the results. People spend a lot of time helping others on this forum, respect that time.

  • Thank you, Ingolf and Michael! Much appreciated here too, guys.


    Hy MonkeyMan!


    I agree with most of what you said. Some comments:

    I think the original "can somebody help" is fine, personally :-) but courtesy is always appreciated.

    Agreed, Michael, in retrospect. I'll edit the point so that it simply encourages folks to consider using the magic words.


    Thanks mate.


    Hmm... I'm a bit on the fence on this. If further posts have been made / it is likely that many/relevant people have already read the original post, I think it's fine to add a new post, to avoid the information getting lost. However, if no other posts have been made since your last one please just edit it instead of making a new one (which I have been guilty of on occasion too :-)).

    This is exactly what I was getting at, Michael; the suggestion doesn't typically apply to situations where further interaction has ensued, and I agree 100%. I'll edit the point so that it clearly specifies that it's multiple, consecutive posts, usually containing only one sentence such as "Oh, and another thing..." or "Also...", that could otherwise have been simple additions to the original, that are best avoided.


    Nice spot there, mate. I s'pose it's 'cause I did this off the top of my head that I failed to realise I hadn't been clear-enough. You don't miss much, brother. Thank you!


    Brilliant! I'll add all of these pertinent points to the OP, mate. Great stuff.


    Thank you for putting your mind to this for a moment, Michael. Very-much appreciated, mate!

  • Nicky has a talent for writing! Very impressive.
    I would hire him to proof read a book :)


    Ash

    Have a beer and don't sneer. -CJ. Two non powered Kempers -Two mission stereo FRFR Cabs - Ditto X4 -TC electronic Mimiq.



  • Nicky, what did you do? That's the biggest post I've seen from you in ages and now my head hurts.


    If the people you're targeting with this post read this, I would be surprised. Perhaps you need to repost this in the non-private forums as well. And perhaps the mods should sticky it as well.

  • LOL It was just an Impulse Response™, AJ.


    EDIT:
    Seems there isn't an appropriate sub-forum in the public area to post this, AJ. The link in my sig won't do those in said area any good either as, I'm guessing, they'll be confronted by a "Verboten" banner of some description if they click it.


    Good ideas 'though matey; they're much-appreciated. ;)

  • Good points.


    Personally I'd like to see less ad hominem attacks and more talk about issues themselves.


    It's possible to talk about issues and be respectful..


    .. even if you like a product.


    Not everybody who disagrees with "you" 1) hasn't read the manual 2) has "golden ears" (oh what a crime) 3) is some kind of "noob" who wants to "ruin the reputation of kemper" (or whatever the heck).


    Cheerios

  • Maybe I should have made point #18 the first.


    So much forum space and readers' time is wasted by folks' quoting by default before they respond. Why should we have to read posts twice (even more often when several are nested)? In everyday conversation, who the heck repeats what was just said to him before responding? Things should flow in the same manner as a normal conversation. I read a post, then a response to it, then another, and so on. I don't want to have to sift through endless unnecessary, repetitious quotes only to be rewarded by a few words or a short sentence.


    IMHO, in many, many cases, we're consuming many times the necessary forum space by quoting a paragraph or three (most-often immediately-following their appearance these days), only to respond with a few words. Some are serial offenders and seem to use the quote button in conjunction with the reply one by default. It's a one-step process to respond; two clicks aren't necessary, and neither is telling someone what he's just written.


    Sorry. Had to get that off my chest. It's become an epidemic and has been heading this way for at least 18 months, hence my including it in the pointers in the OP over a year ago. Sometimes it just frustrates me. Sure, I'm quite OC, but for the love of God I'd like to think I'm not alone on this one. :S

  • Bwahaha, I agree.
    Thinking about it, yes.
    Absolutely!
    :D

  • Sure, I'm quite OC, but for the love of God I'd like to think I'm not alone on this one.

    You speak my heart and you are not alone, brother. :)


    It would be clearer to quote only what you are responding to immediately.
    This could also apply with pictures. It doesn't make sense, to send them several times.

  • Correct, Brother Harry. 8o


    You've also illustrated the most-important point to quoting - you quoted me because you were responding to something I said 4 posts earlier.


    Well, thanks to you guys I don't feel like such an idiot now. I was worried overnight that peeps would be jumping on here and telling me that I'm an old fuddy-duddy, a relic of old-school values and that I'm way-too-uptight... all of which are true, of course. :D

  • All good points, but you forgot - Respect and treat the Monkey right! Any monkey spanking will be punished.


    There is a serious point in there though which is outside of your point about treating everyone with respect -


    Don't Hijack - If you have an aside or new topic, post a new thread! A joke is fine, but your brilliant new idea deserves it's own place and space. If it looks like a new and interesting topic is evolving from an old one then a good way to handle it that saves the mods some time is to make a new thread, copy the link and paste it into the original thread with "This awesome conversation can be continued - here!".