Pete Thorn did a demo of the Helix, I must say I'm impressed now.

  • What a great time to be a guitarist! All these amazing pieces of gear available - all I can do is smile. Competition is a good thing, pushing all parties into newer and better products. As for me, I'm fully invested in Kemper, love the tones I'm getting, and I feel certain that there will be additional enhancements to make it even better. ;)

    Well put! No need to get into competition mode for anybody who is satisfied with the Kemper :-)

    Also: let's not speculate as to whether Pete gets any money without having some kind of evidence to back it up - I think it's bad form. I know it was not intended as such, so not an attack on anyone. But let's refrain from starting internet rumours, even if they don't go beyond this forum :-)

  • I think Helix is a great product, maybe the latest tech one of the best floor model processors. But the "modeling" thing.. I found most of the tones (amps) sound thin even Pete's great playing and mix. Maybe it's convertors cause this.

    Profiling and modeling are very very different methods like apple and pear. Modeling technology is not there yet with the Helix.

    Sound Engineer, Musician, Animal Rights Activist.

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  • it seems it doesn't have so much output routing like our KPA (for example monitoring in stereo plus outputs for main PA)

    The Helix has these outputs:

    2 XLR outs
    2 1/4" outs
    4 1/4" FX send jacks that can also be used as outs
    1 headphone out
    1 SPDIF
    1 USB

    I send stereo (guitar and vocals) from my Helix both to FOH and to my CLR, no problem. IMHO the Kemper has nothing to worry about as far as pure amp tone, and it has a clearly superior harmonizer. But I find the Fuzz Face and Univibe in the Helix much more satisfying than the Kemper's. Each has pluses and minuses in terms of the UI. The routing and form factor differences are obvious.

  • Everything Pete produces in his gear videos sounds great - and frankly - after watching his gear demos for a while - like Pete Thorn.
    The UA-Tone videos sounded great, his pedal demos sound great, .... it is part of his gig!

    Can you imagine him ever recording a video in which he does not sound great?

    Also in the video he says 50% of the tone is coming from his ownhammer IRs .... (he mentiones them quite a few times during the video!!!)
    The market is flooded with good sounding pedals and units - but there is only one device that can actually capture the actual amp you are sitting next to.

    Line 6 fooled me twice with their product update policy. Not anymore.

  • ....

    But I find the Fuzz Face and Univibe in the Helix much more satisfying than the Kemper's.

    That and the hassle of dealing with effect presets the way we currently have to is the reason why I hold on to my pedals and use the kemper like a tube amp most of the time.

  • Also: let's not speculate as to whether Pete gets any money without having some kind of evidence to back it up - I think it's bad form. I know it was not intended as such, so not an attack on anyone. But let's refrain from starting internet rumours, even if they don't go beyond this forum

    That the guitar work is great for me I stated very clearly earlier
    I'am not a moralist, who mean that a good work has to be done without getting paid.
    The use of the official logo Line 6 makes payment via Line 6 very likely. Not to believe, I would find just naive - but that was not the Topic.

    I replied in the probability form (conjunctiv) to a probably not seriously proposal of a Kemper employees connected with an emoticon.
    To compare this with "starting internet rumors" seems to me greatly exaggerated.

  • Also: let's not speculate as to whether Pete gets any money without having some kind of evidence to back it up
    "Because of the amount of time and effort it takes to produce these demos, I have to charge a fee to produce them."

    He always uses his tube amps live when he has the option.

    The key to everything is patience.
    You get the chicken by hatching the egg, not by smashing it.
    -- Arnold H. Glasow

    If it doesn't produce results, don't do it.

    -- Me

  • Very professional demo, as all of Pete´s videos.
    Well, he is a freelancing musician who has to make a living in between studio/tour hires ... and let´s be realistic, he is in the position to charge for them.
    Now knowing this can we derive from this fact that the higher the fee the longer the video is?

    However ... the Helix amp modulations still sound too blank to me ... maybe it´s only me...
    As someone commented earlier in this thread, I think it is rather a competition for the Axe-FX.

    .. and boy oh boy ... I can´t look at them ... these flickering footswitch lights make me completely dizzy. 8|

  • "Because of the amount of time and effort it takes to produce these demos, I have to charge a fee to produce them."

    Yep. Charging a fee to produce a quality demo is not the same as being a paid endorser. Pete has a way of bringing out the best in gear so why not charge for it. Those demos do take a lot of effort.

    Besides, it's not impossible to believe he actually likes the Helix. I doubt he would ever tour with one as his primary rig, but I could see him using it on his own recorded stuff.

  • Thanks Laurens for posting this great review.

    Watched this vid about 5 hours ago, was gonna post a relpy then had to go do a ton of stuff asap.

    Saw that toaster right away, as G pointed out; you so beat me to it
    (cue the digital food fight ;)

    No doubt anywhere that Mr. Thorn has some serious skills. This also means he gets a lot more options
    to choose what he wants to do. It is kind of irrelevant to speculate if he was a paid or not for the demo. First
    of, he is a professional player, which does usually mean getting paid, and there is nothing wrong with that imho.
    (If i was line 6 i would have made him an offer) it's not exactly an endorsemt, like the andertons vid, which is also
    justifiable, since they are a music store, you would expect them to want to sell music gear...

    I also don't think needs to be doing infomercials for sub par gear. I don't have much experience with line 6, so i can't comment
    on "that line 6 sound". Unsurprisingly, most in the KPA forum felt the KPA was better. Or that helix was not their thing, some were
    interested, and i am curious, since i have not had the chance to try one--they cost 2K here, and are sold out, also sold out in most
    music shops in USA, but so are KPA in some places... stores got pillaged this xmas season (yikes, reminds me, gotta goto bank an check
    bills an such later, so i might tend to stretch this post out a bit)

    What I liked was his no nonsense approach to making the demo. Some music for an intro, then a specific chat about what is going on.
    KPA was there, but he didn't mention profiling once, possibly just alluding to people who might like to go the pure modelling route.

    He was pretty upfront about what he likes, such as ownhammer cabs, suhr guitars, and the other gratuitous gear shots are always a plus :) , but they
    also kind of served to show what kind of room this was happening in. You get a feel for this with the mic on the desk early on, it picks up slight taps
    on the helix. It also sounds different depending how close he is to it, especially with the echo. a kind of what you see is what you get--very cool imo.

    He has a very sensible approach to the fact that there is a lot of competition in the modelling/profiling market. up until now all modellers have been competing
    and also what is called complementary technology to various degrees. they can work with each other and outdo each other. Enter the kpa, it can model other
    modellers, amps and in a new way. This makes it to a large extent disruptive technology--game changer could be a similar term. However it is also complementary
    tech,since it can work with other modellers. more on this later...

    All he does is focus on the helix, since that is what the video is all about.

    After the intro he does a step by step breakdown of what the helix is, and does, and shows how he did all of this in a step by step breakdown, commenting on what
    he likes about the device. I don't think anyone here would put something they don't like in a song, video etc, but i am sure there are videos out there on any gear pointing
    out need for improvement etc.

    Tone is in the fingers, but it starts in the ear, grows with experience and taste, with the ability to express this via practice, usually lots of it. I think to say that PT can make
    anything sound good is probably true, but there are some caveats to such a statement. Depending on kind of music etc. almost anything can sound good with creativity, much is
    context. To imply that a device like helix needs someone like pt to sound good, may not be totally fair. It is new, and anyone's guess if or when someone does something with it
    that ends up a popular hit, or great bit of music. It is also contrary to what line 6 is saying, that it has an easy learning curve, and that most people will find it easy and intuitive to
    use, not needing to be a highly skilled player to get decent results. If using IR's helps it sound better that is not a bad thing.

    I was listening to this on a 200$ tablet, thru a pair of sd 280's, another cheap, but very consistent set of headphones, that i am familiar with. However, the jack is not working properly, since it was damaged when my ipod got totally crushed (nye, gf dancing, kinda fell, stepped on it, not sure was trying to catch her, long story...ipod funeral is next week) so it fades out of stereo, gets scratchy, and needs to be held in place to connect. I would not make a 2k buying decision this way, but when i managed to hear it all in stereo, and it sounded ok, the tones were ok, nothing there to blow you away, but nothing you could say anything really bad about. I am on the fence about looking into this line 6 grit, no point really, if people here say it is there i will believe them, and not spend x time getting my ears used to spotting it. Tweaking out bad sounds, is not what it is for, and if there are issues live
    that is what the line 6 team should be tweaking via software etc.

    from what i heard and saw, and having a kpa, i dont think i would get this for $2k, unless i hit the lotto. Sure it does look nice, and im curious about how the capacitance foot switches will play out. the led strips are cool, as is the screen, but then this simply brings up a question of where will it lead? It does look nice, and right at home in a studio, but will it stay clean if gigged? It also looks bigger and not as easy to move around as the toaster right beside it. Bit talking this product concept to its full conclusion, why not just make a full lcd
    foot controller, something like raven 2, but durable, where you can have batches etc, more info popping up, event / time triggered, and with the ability to fully customize the screen with skins, etc? It could have fx, amp sims, extensive midi...

    One thing I am curious about is midi, something like this should be very good at it. not much was said here. This is where the idea of tech working together and replacing itself does get fuzzy. nothing is 100% in this way. cliche car analogy? you can put a motor on a buggy, or pull a car with horses....not the best ideas, but they have probably been tried.
    this device is supposed to work with tube amps well, and offer more flexibility with them, it should also do the same with other modellers. I haven't looked into the midi details, but they are not talked about very much, be curious to see what people here know about it. as a do it all board it would have a lot more value to more people...

    Also contacting PT, why not? he even asks for people to subscribe to his videos, so I can only guess more feedback would be fine. To a/b the same tracks would be interesting to a point, a/b with a profile of them also? To some extent it is a bit apples to oranges, and different methods. I am guessing that if there were to be such a kpa demo, it would be quite a bit different, showing how it operates, sounds, something on profiling, all kinds of things. but i dont think it would really focus on helix or other things, unless they worked with the kpa, such as frfr, cabs, etc. would be interesting to see for sure. I would also like to see him do a demo of the isp theta pro, that company should track him down for such a demo.
    even if it is a paid demo, you are hiring a well respected expert to show off your new device that you are proud to have just made to the world. Should be part of the ad budget for new gear, since it is likely that they will do and find things that you may not be able to. as long as everything is represented accurately, there is nothing wrong with this.

    speaking of bugets.. bills await... as does new and shiny gear in this perilous world. wish me luck ;)

  • Probably 'cause all but the newest of newbies have certainly seen it, and have likely played the song portion over several times, Netheravon, but thank you for linking it mate.

    I replied in the probability form (conjunctiv) to a probably not seriously proposal of a Kemper employees connected with an emoticon.

    Hey Harry, this is by far your most entertaining and cryptic post yet, brother! Very funny.

    I know you won't take this the wrong way; I very much enjoy reading your posts and am so glad you contribute even though English is tricky for you. Good for you, mate.

  • OK, due to slow DL bandwidth, I finally got to watch it (Mac speaker only).

    Love the sound of the Suhr. That mid-range warmth provides such a welcome relief from the "hollow-sounding" tones I've now come to expect from the Helix.

    Lack of warmth overall, whether it's tube warmth, analogue warmth or what have you.

    That's all I've got to say, much to everyone's relief I'm Suhr... :D

    PS: Why did I get a completely different set of emoticons to choose from, as well as a much more comprehensive tool set when I wrote the post? I then had to go back and remove all the formatting BS along with the original emoticon in order to get it to look right; the original set of tools and emoticons I'm used to had returned.

    From memory it was different from the "More Options" set.

  • It's understandable you'd wonder that, benvigil. After all, most if not all the demos released in the first 6 months since its announcement sported sufficiently-suffocated raw tones that it was difficult to make judgements about them.

    I'd expect that by now there's be a tonne of "dry" demos out there, and I'd be inclined to assume that if there weren't, there's something to hide...